GURJAR OR GUJJAR : WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE

[Ashok Harsana]

Suny
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Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Thread Started on 4/6/06 at 1:40 »

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Hi friends,

Good Blog must say...
well i need some info ....can u tell me the difference between GURJAR,GUJAR and GUJJAR...i knw there is a difference between them...but what is the difference.....

are gujjars in garhwal different from the gujjars in plains like UP,Haryana and rajasthan..

In maharashtra gujars are brahmin....
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gurjar#Maharastran_Gujjars
how is that so....

Waiting for Reply....
Please do not put guesses...
its important to know what should we tell when we somebody ask us...

April 06 , 2006

Suny




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Arun
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #1 on 4/6/06 at 1:42 »

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i am sure they are different, because indian government website mention them with different names in diff states...

ncbc.nic.in/backward-classes/index.htm
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GurjarGujjarGujarGoujar
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #2 on 4/6/06 at 14:07 »

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Jaise tum kabhi kabhi Bap ko Bappu Kahte Ho, Vahi difference hai.Bap to Bap Hi rahata hai
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Thakur
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #3 on 4/6/06 at 20:08 »

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Gurjar/Gujjar/Gujar all are same. In Punjab the clan are called as Gujjar. Sanskrit word is Gurjar and in hindi it Gujar, similar to Baman, Bahman Brahmin etc.
The Gurjars (Gujjars) were Pratihars (The protector) of India and every other kings was either Vassal or fuedatory till 10th. century ,their Brahmins, to perform the Puja etc. used to be different than others and were considered to superior than others, Like Brahmins from Kannauj, the kingdom of Gujjar Pratihars. These brahmins are called as Gurjar Brahmin.
This is similar to the fact that Barbers also call themselves as Thakurs, that means barber of Thakurs or Barber Thakur and these barbers can not provide their services to other inferior races. These barbers instead of calling themselves as barber Thakur call themselves Thakur only.
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Veer Gujjar
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #4 on 4/7/06 at 14:25 »

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Gurjar is a Sanskrit word. In hindi it is pronunciated as Gujar and in Punjabi as Gujjar similar to Delhi is spoken as Dilli in local hindi accent. All are Khastriya who ruled over India from 6th. to 12th. Century and many of them are present day Rajputs sharing the same Gotras are of Gujjar Origin.
For Example in the original National Anthem of India written by Guruwar Shri Rabindranath Tagore the word Gurjar is used but in the Hindi Version it is replaced by the word gujarata. see the present modified Indian National Anthem in hindi as follows.

Jana-gana-mana-adhinayaka, jaya he
Bharata-bhagya-vidhata
Punjab-Sindhu-Gujarata-Maratha-Dravida-Utkala-Banga
Vindhya-Himachala-Yamuna-GangaUjwala-Jaladhi-taranga
Tava shubha name jage Tava shubha ashish maage
Gaye tava jaya-gatha
Jana-gana-mangala-dayaka jaya he
Bharata-bhagya-vidhata
Jaya he, jaya he, jaya he,Jaya jaya jaya, jaya he !



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suny
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #5 on 4/8/06 at 1:13 »

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if we have such a great history...and we are like kshatriya , then y we are in backward class.
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Thakur
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #6 on 4/8/06 at 12:36 »

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What do you mean by like Kshtriya and to which class you belong to? If you are asking about Gujjars yes they educationally backwards but not socially bacwards. This list also varies from state to state and place to place since in some of the states they not educationally even backwards. Moreover there are some regions defined which is classified as ST area and irrespective of caste and creed everybody residing there is defined as ST.
Gujjars are a warrior class and were overlords of many kings for 400 years and were busy fighting all the times with Arabs and Britishers and hence could not get time to get their children educated. That is the reason of being educationally backward. You take the case of Sachin Tendulkar, he is a great cricketer and his wife is doctor but he is not even a graduate since he does not get any time for his education. Similar was the case of all the Kahtriyas and they remained educationally backward.

During british period there were some former untouchables who provided good maid servants from their community to britishers and there childern were helped to get education by their british masters. You probaly belong to this community and are suffering from severe inferiority complex which normally is the case with all the neo-converts.
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Thakur
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #7 on 4/8/06 at 17:24 »

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The Criterias adopted by Mandal Commission for adopting caste for determining social and educational backwardness. The Commission, after a very thorough scientific investigation has with the help of experts from various disciplines worked out 11 indicators to determine social backwardness. These indicators are social, educational and economic which are adopted by the commission. The actual criteria used by the Commission formulated by having 11 indicators by the commission are:

Social

Castes/classes considered as socially backward by others.

Castes/classes which mainly depend on manual labour for their livelihood.

Castes/classes where the percentage of married women below 17 is 25% above the state average in rural areas and 10% in urban areas; and that of married men is 10% and 5% above the state average in rural and urban areas respectively.

Castes/classes where participation of females in work is at least 25% above the state average.
Educational

Castes/classes where the number of children in the age group of 5 to 15 years who never attended school is at least 25% above the state average.

Castes/classes where the rate of student drop-out in the age group of 5-15 years is at least 25% above the state average.

Castes/classes amongst whom the proportion of matriculates is at least 25% below the state average
Economic

Castes/classes where the average value of family assets is at least 25% below the state average.

Castes/classes where the number of families living in kachcha houses is at least 25 % above the state average.

Castes/classes where the source of drinking water is beyond half a kilometer for more than 50% of the households.

Castes/classes where the number of the house-holds having taken a consumption loan is at least 25% above the state average.

The Gujjars are backward in aducation in some of the states but not socially and economically backwards.
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Suny
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #8 on 4/8/06 at 21:52 »

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Thanks Thakur for the great reply.
now i know why we are so backward because we can do our grads and post grads in big universties but we always forget our basic rules of talking to people.
Really appreciate the way you tried to identify my caste, brother. seems u respect ur cast that means only you as individual not the gujar caste, if u cannot show respect to other member of ur caste, then who else would do.....there is no point making big sabhas, big political parties for gujar..unless u r able to respect the human being.
good, i can see one more HUMAN coming in the world with great ideas.
and by the way i am a gujar and does not belong any such caste where there ancesstors have send there wives,daughters to britishers.
if u think there were some gujars like that way because u know more history in this blog, then i have a same doubt on you.

Thanks buddy for the reply related to 11 criterias, really that was helpful.





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Thakur
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #9 on 4/10/06 at 11:28 »

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Hi Suny,
As per 1953 Kaka kalelkar report, based on these criterios, every Woman of India was listed as a backward person, irrespective of caste and creed. Now based on your logic our country can not have a great history.But Gujjars and india had a great history. This is also fact that Mongolia today is backward country. Will that mean that Gengis Khan was not from that country? So Why are you raising a non issue.
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suny
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #11 on 4/11/06 at 18:09 »

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8-)Thakur marvellous job !!!
Suny ji, let put some more light on the subject. I have met many-many Gujjars who are ashamed to be known in community as Gujjars. See whatever is coming out of you is nothing but frustraction. I also knew nothing about my caste but I READ !!!! Lots of literature is available. Now I am gonna give you some insight and you may also feel proud of being Gujjar/ Backward.
We are the earliest warrior clan in India. The word Gujjar/Gujar/Gurjar are all "Tadbhav" of the "Tatsam" GURTAR. We were so efficient and able warriors that even the Guru (In Gurukuls) feld proud of. "Aisa shishya jise pakar guru bhi tar jaye".
We ruled this country. We are the ones who didn't let Mughals enter our mother land for approx. 400 years.
When mughals were returning after looting Somnath temple they tried their way through our empire, we faught and captured/killed many. Those who were captured were converted to Hindus and they were called (or awarded the gotra) Baghel & Shekhawat.
Did this ring some BELLS for you ? Boss Baghel and Shekhawat are Rajputs not Gujjars. Question is why ? Because we were at the epitome of rule so we couldn't let them share our status.
A good question is who are Rajputs ? Suny sir, you must be knowing that we had a custom of polygamy. So only the eldest son of PATRANI could be crowned the next king. Then what about the children from rest of the RANIs ? They were given a name RAJ-PUTRA. All their expenses will be born by the Kingdom and they will enjoy all privilages. I don't want to hurt anyones feeling but when some one will have of the order of 10-20-30 Queens how can he be d**n sure that all the children are fathered by him only. So there was a doubt regarding the legitimacy of those (This is why they can't be kings). Mind it this was a real scenario.
GREED is a very bad trait of human being. RAJ-PUTRS became greedy for KINGDOM, betrayed their own mentors and made us weak and let them MUGHALS come into India. They tried all possible ways even marrying their own sister to Mughals e.g. JodhaBai married to Akbar.
Read history first time RAJPUT word comes in 11-12 AD. What about their origin ? Where did they come from? In which manuscript their origin is evident ? Don't listen to the crap if anyone tells you , that they were born out of Hawan-Kund when some rishi prerformed Yagya for some one for Rishi's rescue for safety etc etc.
Now sir we lost the Kingdoms. But still we had lots of lands and zamindaris. We didn't pay TAXES to mughals and kept on fighting with them. Gorilla/ Chhamaar Yudh.
Then came British. Again RAJPUTs befriended with them and so did many mughals. They passed on a information that GUJJARS are a NASTY clan. They are Roudy/Notorious/Dacoits etc etc and YES we faught with BRITISH as well.
When was the first Rebellion in India surfaced ? 1856 is the obvious answer. No no no dear it was 1824.
Riyasat of King Vijay Singh rebelled against BRITISH. We beheaded 100s 1000s of BRITISH, looted the Government treasury, dragged them 100s of KOS (measurement unit in ancient India). Ummmm how do I know this ? Well Suny ji I am from the village where Vijay Singhs Fort was. Kunja Bahadar Pur , Tahsil Bhagavanpur (8kms from Roorkee). Waise for your kind information University of Roorkee (IITR now) is build on land donated by the King of Landhora Riyasat (Gujjar Riyasat near Luksar/Roorkee).
Let us come back to point again. So sir we were declared as NOTIFIED TRIBE. What does it mean? It means confiscate our property, adult males were obvious choice to be put into jails for any Chori/Dacoity/ANYTHING you may think of. We were humiliated like anything.
Then came the day of independence. Netas felt PITY on us so they tagged us as DENOTIFIED TRIBE.
There was a quota for DT in UoR.
And we became BACKWARDS !!!!!
So are you still ASHAMED of being BACKWARD/GUJJAR.
Why every body know about Mangal PANDEY not VIJAY SINGH ?
Why there is no HISTORY of GUJJARS being taught in textbooks ?
Why there is NO GUJJAR regiment in Indian Army ? (remember we were the best WARRIORS)
What about our zamindaris ? Why didn't the Govt gave us back our Zamindaris ? Had we been given what we had all these GENERAL CASTES would have been living on our wages !!!!

I Think it is enough .... if you still feel ASHAMED I am also ASHAMED that I couldn't make u understand properly.
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Thakur
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #12 on 4/11/06 at 19:02 »

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Why there is no Gujjar Regiment, because Gujjars were not available to Britishers. The Brahmins were not available to them. The frw who were available, the britishers had to have the taste of it like Gopal Pandey and mangal pandey.The Rajputs were not available to them. That is why Britishers had to mix Rajputs, Gujjars and Brahmins to make only one Regiment i,e, Rajput Regiment.
There were others where Britishers ready found cheap Military labour very easily and made the regiments.
Now Govt. of india does not promote caste based Regiments and there is no questions of having anymore Caste based regiments.
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kunwarprashantsinghgujjar
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #13 on 4/11/06 at 20:25 »

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Thakur ji,
Its not suny who has written the last long message its me "Kunwar Prashant", today I applied for membership.
To put Suny as the Author's name was the best idea clicked to my mind to attarct his attention
No offenses please !!!! But why the hell British had to name that regiment RAJPUT regiment. Not Gujjar regiment, not Brahmin Regiment ?? Any thoughts.
Hon'able Govt. of India does not promote caste based bifurcation but it could have abolished. Any thoughts ??

[Ashok Harsana]

AP Singh
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #61 on 4/21/06 at 13:07 »

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Hi Everybody,
It is not only that Gurjar.Gujar, Gujjar, Juzr, are the one and the same in various literature. in chinese literature they are mentioned as Ku-che-lo.

See how the Gujjar empire from 550 to 950 A.D. as seen by various Visiting scholars.

1. Hiuen Tsang from China:
About sixty years after the destruction of the Huna supremacy in nortthern India, there arose another Empire at Kanuj under Harshavardan (606 to 647 A.D.), but Rajasthan(29) lay out of his suzerainty. Hiuen Tsang mentions the existence of independent Gurjara (Ku-che-lo) kingdom with Pi-lo-mo-lo, which has been indefined with Bhillamala, modern Bhinamal, as its Capital.

2. Sulaiman, The Arab Scholar:

Sulaiman an Arab traveller, who visited India in 851 A.D. refers to Bhoj Prathihar in Vivid terms and states that the king maintained numerous forces and that not other Indian prince had so fine a cavalry. He further observes that there was no greater foe of the Muhammadan faith than him. He had great riches and his camels and horses were numerous. No country in India was more safe than his country.

3. Al Masudi A traveller from Bagdad:
Al Masudi a native of Bagdad, who visited India in the year 915-16 A.D. refers to the great power and resources of the Pratihar king of Kanauj, and the wide extent of his kingdom, which touched Rashtrakuta kingdom in the South and the Muslim Principality of Multan in the west with both of whom the king was at war. He was rich in horses and camels and maintained four armies in four directions each numbering 7,00,000 or 9,00,000 men.

And with all this strength(40) , even though the Pratiharas could have easily exterminated the Muslim rule in the Sindh province, they allowed it to remain there. It appears that the danger of the Muslim meance was not fully realized by them. Had they possessed even a general knowledge of the political condition of the lands immediate outside the borders of India on the north-west, they would not have committed such a grave mistake. The indifference of the Hindu Chiefs in general cost them terribly very soon.





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ParvinderGurjar
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Re: Gurjar / Gujjar what is the difference
« Reply #62 on 4/22/06 at 0:24 »

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Hi AP Singh Bhai, and all gurjar Brother,

I am writing this mail only because on samaj sandesh all of us only talks about Gurjar Partihar kingdom. It is very difficult for me to write this mail. And no body can complete this mail but we can discuss here about the following kingdoms

Let me have pleasure to present the list of different gurjar kingdoms at different era.

1) Yhezhi ended at 177BCE
2) Kushan (1CE-375CE) Capital at Peshawar and Mathura.
3) Gujratra
a. Chap ruler – fouder was Yashodharma Vikramaditya-(475CE-712 CE), Yashodharma was first Gurjareshwer founded the Capital at Bhinmal but was ruined by Arabs even there chronology is not available only four kings of the chap ruler are mention at the various piller inscriptions.
b. Partihar – Fouder Was Dadda I (650CE-1036CE), Nagbhat led the tittle of Gurjareshwar in 732CE, capital at Ujjain.
c. Solanki – Founder Was Mulraj I (942CE-1244CE), Mulraj himself adopted the title of Gurjareshwar.

These are the different gurjar feudatories under Gurjratra at different era
1) Maitrik of Vallabhi Nagar
2) Parmar of Malwa
3) Chauhan of Shakamberi
4) Chauhans of Ajmer
5) Chandellas of Bundelkhand
6) Solankis of Anhilwada Patan (Gujarat)
7) Tawar of Delhi
8) Chawada Dynasity

Chalukyan Dynasty of Deccan
1) Chalukyas of Badami
2) Chalukyas of Kalyani
3) Chalukyas of Vengi
4) Chalukyas of Vatapi
Note: -- Chalukyan Dynasty was known for there Art & Culture. The rock-cut temples of Pattadakal,Badami and Aihole, and the some of the celebrated paintings and sculptures of the Ellora and Ajanta caves are examples of the art that the Chalukya Empire patronized. They evolved a new style, which is known as the Chalukyan architecture. It has been described as belonging to the vesara style, a combination of the South Indian or Dravida and the North Indian or Nagara Styles. "In Karnataka history, Chalukyan period is considered as golden age.
After 1300CE the whole india was divided into small kingdoms. And many of the great Gurjar kings & leaders led the people and fought against the invaders like mughals and Britishers. And they are as follows.
 Guhil of Chitor
 Chatrapati Shivaji Rao Bhonsle and four diiferent Bhonsle Kingdoms
 Pratap Rao Gurjar (Army Chieftent of Shivaji)
Gurjaraghar
 Ghurria Princely State
 Chabadi Princely State
Gurjar Kingdom Of North India
 SialKot
 Landora
 Pariknutsgarh
 Dadri
 Samthar
Peel Nagar, Buklana, Mundlana were the very small riyasats.
Only Landora’s and Samthar’s family still exist today and rest of the riyasat was ended by British in 1857.
Maharaja Rajit Singh Judeo is the present king of samther.
Dilip Singh Judeo also Belong to the same family (Cabinate minister in the prevoius BJP govt) --------Whose moustache was very famous the previous in last election in chattisgarh.
Few of the main fighters in the history
• Veer Yograj Singh Gurjar 14-15th century
• Bagdawat (they were 24 brothers son of Bagharawat)
• Hari Singh Nalwa (Army Chieftent of Raja Ranjit Singh of Punjab)
• Guru Gobind Singh (Son Of Gurjari Mata)



The complete information about the kingdoms is not possible for me to write on this platform. If i have left any of the kingdoms please complete the information.

Bye for now

Parvinder Gurjar

[rajeshchoudhary]

Dear all Gujjars/Gurjar/Gujars
There is no difference between these names its only a pronounciation problem like who is Punjabi will tell himself Gujjar and who is from Haryana, Himachal and Rajsthan they called themselves, so dear there is no difference between these.

Regards

Rajesh Choudhary (Gujjar)

[spbhadana]

HI ASHOK

I REALY APPRAISE YOUR JOB. IT IS REALY A GREAT WORK. I AM EXTREMELY HAPPY TO SEE THIS SITE.EVERY GURJAR SHOULD PROUD OF YOU.



REGARDS
SATYAPAL SURYAVANSHI
COMPUTER ENGINEER
A BHADANA GURJAR

[spbhadana]

THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE IN GUJAR & GURJAR. IN REAL IT IS GURJAR(A SANSKRIT WORD) BUT PRONOUNCED AS GUJJAR OR GUJAR. IT IS COMBINATION OF TWO SANSKRIT WORDS i.e. GUR & UJAR.IN SANSKRIT GUR MEANS ENEMY( SATRU OR DUSHMAN) & UJAR MEANS KILLER & DEFEATER.TOTAL MEANS KSHETRIYA OR MARSHAL OR PARTIHAR.



SATYAPAL SINGH SURYAVANSHI

COMPUTER ENGINEER
BHADANA GURJAR

[mrsingh]

Hi gurjar bhaio
This is same thing but Pronunciation or Terminology diffrence
As per my opnion
Mukhram Singh Gurjer Rainkwal