Reasons for Jat, Gujjar rivalry

[Ashok Harsana]

Its a well known thing in Northern India that although Jats and Gujjars share almost same culture, surnames, languages, Physiqal attributes, they never walk together....Whats the reason...

Gujjars fought against the british and Jats favoured Britishers against their own countrymen. Thats why Jats were gifted the land snatched from Gujjars in Delhi NCR. Though it was not the case with all the Jats (but it can be said regarding the Jats migrated to Delhi from Sonipat and other areas). They were settled here by Britishers. Even today we may check the land revenue records and will find that many Jat Villages are on lease by govt (kishangarh, Lado Sarai near Mehrauli). Moreover these particular Jat villages have more than 10-12 surnames migrated frm different regions of haryana.

Read this:
www.csas.ed.ac.uk/mutiny/history.html

In the early 19th century huge areas of grazing lands around Delhi, used by the Gujars, Rangars and Bhattis were cleared and given by the British to Jat peasant farmers to cultivate. These communities were therefore amongst the first to resort to arson and banditry as soon as British control collapsed in 1857. They all had one thing in common, being in one way or another losers in the land revenue settlements of the early nineteenth century.

www.csas.ed.ac.uk/mutiny/history.html

Please Note: This thread is not meant to disgrace the Jat Community in any mean. Every caste or community has all kinds of people, some of them are good and some are bad. This is a historical fact, which is mentioned above and any discussion on the same is welcomed. Any hatred posts against Jats or Gujjars will not be entertained and will be deleted with the immediate effect.

[dipakgurjar]

Dear Ashok Bhai
I have one incident of Gurjar and Jat rivalry to share with you.Sohna is a Gurjar dominated area . Gurjar Khatanas are the most dominating gurjars of this area.During the British Rule the khatanas of Damdama and Rithoj revolted against British.The king of Ballabhgarh Raja Ballu who was an ally of British and fougt against Gurjars.There are still some houses in these Gurjar villages where the festival of Raksha Bandhan is not celebrated even today.The reason behind this is that Gurjars of these villages were hanged by Britishers who were ally of Ballu on the eve of Raksha Bandhan.This was the reason why people use to say that khatanas don’t celebrate Raksha Bandhan.

Names of Brave Gurjar Of Revolt of 1857
Name Gotra Village

Dhan Singh Kotwal Chaprana Panchali
Achal Singh Gurjar Bidhuri Tugalkabad
Rao Umrao Singh Gurjar Bhati Dadri
Inder Singh Gurjar Rathi Guthavli Kalan
Trimurti Gurjar Rossey Sharakpur
Bishan Singh Gurjar Dedha Chorda
Kanhaiya Singh Gurjar Nangdi Bhadole
Umrao Singh Giujar Bhati Mankapur
Daya Ram Gurjar Khari Chandrawal
Himmat Singh Gurjar Khatana Rithoj
Bhika Ram Gurjar Bokan Darbaripur
Abhat Singh Gurjar Bhomla Khor
Bhajan Singh Gurjar Khatana Bahalpa

Attachments:

[AP Singh]

The Ballabh Grah family was against Britishers.Great Freedom fighter Nahar Singh was from this family.

One of the daughter of this ballabh Garh family of Jats was married with a Sansi prince from the family of Raja Ranjeet Singh. Sansis of Punjab were targeted by the Britishers and as a result were deprived of their properties and many of them sell vegetable in Delhi today. Also Sansis were declared Criminal tribes like Gujjars and Tagas ( Tagas of Saharanpur only, not of Meerut). Probably to show the solidarity with their Sansis relatives of Punjab the Ballabh Garh Jat family opposed Britishers and as a result lost their propertes. I read somewhere that to get the support of Nahar Singh Britishers offered them the property of Tughlakabad fort but he preferred to remain with his sansi relatives.

[vij]

Gurjar and Jaat are rivals not just now but since ancient times.

But one thing is sure that Gurjars have been at the receiving end during the last 200 years.

Lot of it was due to opposition to British and also the British followed the policy of divide and rule

British Identified the Jaat and gave all possible help to them and made popaganda in their favour but at the same time tried to destroy the Great Gurjar History.

Jaats actively helped British like the Bharatpur and Dholpur states and Jind state in rajasthan and Haryana

While Gurjar rulers of Landhaura (Uttarakhand), Dadri (UP), Kila Parikshitgarh (UP) opposed the British

A Gurjar Chieftain ,Govind Singh who had support of many Gurjar Landlords who belonged to a villages near Ghaziabad along with the Ruhella Pathans had an important role in the defeat of the army of Jaat Raja Surajmal on the banks of Hindon River.

Jaat Raja Surajmal could not dare to advance and expand his kingdom into Upper Doab (Meerut, Noida, Saharanpur,Muzaffarnagar) due to the presence of several Gurjar rulers at that time in that area

1.Raja of Dadri------------------Bir Singh Bhati-----ruler of tract from Delhi to Aligarh
2.Raja of Kila Parikshitgarh---Nain Singh Nagar----ruler of Meerut
3.Raja of Landhaura ----------Ramdayal Singh Panwar--Ruler of Saharanpur,Muzaffarnagar,Haridwar and Dehradun.

Gurjars are slowly rising in all fields and more so in the last 20-30 years the progress is so much that even Jaats and Tyagis are recognising the Rise Of Gurjars.

These two caste have benefitted the most from British Rule in Western UP and Gurjars lost everything but it is the GURJAR SPIRIT which has allowed and will allow the Gurjar to regain the predominant position

[VIJAY]

Hi Friends

I hope you are doing well. Ashok’s post has compelled me to write on the forum. First of all the topic itself is controversial. We should avoid these kinds of comparisons because whatever your motive is,it will only spread hatred between two communities.

Let’s talk step by step.

Ashok have mentioned that not all Jats but some Jats supported British. Gujjar lands were given to Jats as a favor and this is the main reason of Rivalry. When you know yourself that only some Jats supported Britishers than why did you started a topic Jat and Gujjar rivalry. You could have named the topic as Rivaly between some Jats and some Gujjars. This would have helped the purpose. Koi baat nahin agar aap ne ye topic chun hi liya to lets talk about it. Agar aap main kuch kehne ki Himmat hai to sunne ki bhi himmat honi chahiye.

I see lot of contradictions in what is written about Jats on this website and what is actually happening in reality. If you feel that Gujjars cannot get along with Jats than why your leaders fought elections on Jat party ticket in Western UP. Your leaders Sanjay Singh Chauhan and Madan Bhaiya fought election on RLD ticket.
Why Bhadana was sharing Hukka with Tikait during Gujjar reservation movement. When Jats openly supported Gujjar’s ST reservation demand, why Gujjars did not tell them that we do not need your support because you supported Britishers against us. Why this double standard?

Second thing I want to ask all Gujjar friends that what you will get out of this discussion. If Gujjars really feel that their Land was given to Jats than they should do something about it. At least start a movement and bring awareness between Gujjars and raise your demand to get the land back. British left us in 1947, since than Gujjars have done nothing to get their land back. However Jats under the leadership of Jat Mahasabha were able to get their Lands back from Rajputs after Independence. Several movies have been made on that Struggle. Especially Ghulami was based on the true story of Ch Ranjit Singh’s struggle against Thakurs. Aur kuch nahin kar sakte to kam se un villages ka hi kuch karo jinka naam aap ne mention kiya hai. Aur agar ye bhi nahin kar sakte to kaum se kaum aise topic to mat discuss karo.

One Bhai mentioned that Vallabgarh Jats supported British. I feel sorry for his knowledge that he is completely unaware of great freedon fighter Raja Nahar Singh of Vallabh Garh.

haryanatourism.gov.in/destination/rajanaharsingh.asp

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raja_Nahar_Singh

www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Raja_Nahar_Singh

Another mentioned that Raja Sural Mal supported British and could not advance beyond Dadri because of Gujjars. Raja Sural Mal’s bravery and his achievements have been recognized by all Historians. He was undisputed king of Medieval India. Raja Sural Mal captured the fort of Agra from Mughals and also defeated them in Delhi. Sural Mal Kingdom started from Bharatpur, Agra, Mathura, Koil, Aligarh, Haryana, Faruknagar near Loni. Kindly visit the hyperlink.

www.maharajasurajmalfoundation.com/Jat-Power.html

www.maharajasurajmalfoundation.com/jatkingdom.html

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suraj_Mal_of_Bharatpur

www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Raja_Suraj_Mal

British lost about 3000 soldiers during the battle of Bharatpur and could not capture it and they eventually had to sign treat with Bharatpur.

Now I have a question for Mr Vij. Mr Vij as per your comment if Suraj Mal was not able to advance beyond Meerut because of Gujjar Kings than what made Gujjar king stopped advancing their kingdom beyond Saharanpur or Dadri. Why they could not spread their kingdom in Haryana, Bagpat, Mathura, Agra, Hathras. Aligarh and Bharatpur.

Bharatpur have significant population of Gujjars than why they did not oppose Suraj Mal rule. Sural Mal fight was against Mughals not against Gujjars. He defeated Mughals in every battle. Kindly read Sural Mal’s History. Gujjars and Jats never had direct wars between them in History. Several Jats were part of Mihir Bhoj army and several Gujjars were part of Suraj Mal and Samrat Ashok Army. There is no question of one is scared of other. Gujjars and Jats have always lived together like brothers.
Raja Sural Mal and Raja Nahar Singh were brave son of India. They lived for India and died for India. Do not use derogatory words for these Kings just because they are Jats.

Before you comment on a community it is very important to do research on the community. You will get your answers. It is very easy to bash anyone on your forum because there is no accountability. On this website you guys bash every community. It looks like baki saaron ne to chudiyan pehen rakhi hain.
No one is perfect and same applies on the community. Today some Gujjars are fighting for reservation and some Gujjars are against it and supporting Gehlot govt. The Gujjars who are supporting the Govt are traitors of community. When your own community have traitors than how come you expect other community people to be 100% loyal.

Some Rajputs favored British and Mughals and some fought against it. But it is unfair to Label the whole community as traitors. We were not democracy in those days. One king use to make the decision for his personal gains and whole population has to live and die for his decision. If some Rajput King supported Mughals than it is unfair to call all Rajputs as traitors.
Jaichand, the traitor was Rajput and Maharan Pratap the warior was also Rajput. Sab log ek jaise nahin ho sakte and that’s why we are called humans.

Kuch Gujjar chori kiya karte thee it does not mean we will label all Gujjars as thieves. Kuch Musalman kharab hain kya iska matlab hai saari community kharab hai.

Coming back to Gujjar- Jats rivalry. I have seen the interview of DU President who is Gujjar. He looked to be a very decent guy and he acknowledged in his interview that not only Gujjars but Jat Bhai also supported me in the election. If your own leaders are recognizing Jat support than why to start something which does not make any sense.

I hope you remember the time when Tikait did his rally at Boat Club. Our PM and Central Govt were at their knees and were pleading Tikait to call off the rally but he did not. All Jats were supporting Tikait. Our Prime Minster requested Jat leaders to go and talk to Tikait and everyone declined to do so. Than our PM requested Rajesh Pilot to go and talk to Tikait. Initially Pilot was reluctant but then he agreed to talk to Tikait.

Than Pilot came to tikait and said that Ch Sahab main badi ummeed leke aap ke paas aaya hoon meri Izzat rakh lena. Than Tikait replied to Pilot that Bhai pehle too tuhje aana nahin chahiye thha. Pur ab jab tu aa hi gaya hai too hum teri Izzat girne nahin denge. Rally was called off next day. This is an eg: of affection Jats have for Gujjars. Tikait woh leader thaa jisne VP Singh ko khait ke dole pe bhita ke ar sakore main paani pya diya thaa. Usne Rajesh Pilot ki baat kisi dabav main ya darr ki wajah se nahin maani balki aapsi bhaichare ki wajah se maani thi.
I have seen lot of anti Jat propaganda on this website. One guy was saying that Bhagat Singh is not Jat. You guys get so critical when it comes to talk about Jat Icons. Jat comminty ke ICONS ko bhi aap non Jat prove karne main lage huye ho. Aapki baton se aisa lagta hai ki saare ke saare Jat bechare darpok hain aur bahadur to sirf gujar hi ho sakta hai. Bhai Jat bhi jahan rehte hain sina thok ke rehete hain unhen touch karne ki himmat kisi ki nahin hai. Give me one eg Jahan per Jat Gujron ke darr se apna Gaon, Jamin chhod ke bhaag gaye hon. Bahadur ki sabse badi pehchaan hoti hai bahadur ki kadar karna. How can you expect a respect from someone when you yourself don’t give respect to anyone? You should treat people the way you wanted be treated.

Some was saying that Jats have no problem in Inter Caste marriages. I am sure this guy is not watching news. Every channel is talking about Khap Panchayats for not allowing Inter Gotra marriages. Community which is killing people for the Gotra marriages how come they can tolerate Inter caste marriages.
Don’t get me wrong I am completely against Khap Panchayats. Marrying someone is a personal decision and as Humans we should not force our decision on any body.

One problem I see in Gujjars is that they compare themselves with Jats. Which is little unfair and not practical. Jat is a very big community in comparison to Gujjars. They have more political clout than Gujjars. In democracy Population matters and Gujjar population in not big enough in any state of Northen India where they can have their own CM. Govt policies in Haryana, Punjab, Rajasthan and Delhi Western UP will favor Jats because of Jats votes.

The reason Jats got into OBC without any fight is because of their voting power. They can make or break govt. The reason Gujjars are having struggle in achieving because they cannot make or break Rajasthan Govt and other problem is unity.
I would request all Gujjars brothers who spend time on this forum to visit Rajasthan and support your brothers for the reservation demand. You guys keep talking about Great Gujjars history. Your ancestors have given you a proud history. Now it is an opportunity for you guys to write and give the proud history to your children’s. Go and get the ST reservation.

In the end I would like to say that Rajputs, Jats, Gujjars and Yadavs all are brave people. They have all kinds of people good and bad. Jab hamare desh ki sarhdon per muskil hoti hai to ye hi log apni jaan dete hain. Most importantly we all are Indians first than Gujjar, Jat and Rajputs. It is good to know about your community and its history but it important to make sure that your love for community does not turn into Fanatic.

I can say there is no rivalry between Jats and Gujjars atleast from Jat side. Jat always consider Gujjars are brothers. My best friend is alos Gujjar.

Good Luck
[/quote]

[progressive]

The Imperial Gazetteer of India states that throughout the Indian Rebellion of 1857, the Gujars and Musalman (Muslim) Rajputs proved the "most irreconcilable enemies" whereas Jats supported them. The entire estate of Mev / Muslim Jagirdaars were given to Jat chieftains of Hariyana and Punjab. There are several such examples. In Delhi, Jats were the main basis of spy network of britishers in 1857 (see "last mugal").

I am reproducing my earlier submission as well :

No two communities like Gujar and Jat can be compared without taking into account of their historical background, responses to invaders/ foreigners in past, level of opportunism, cleverness/shrewdness in availing benefits from a particular situation ..............etc.

Jats have been termed as "Pilars of British Empire" by the historians.

Jat opposed all over India Mandal commission report's implementation by V P Singh, even Vishvendra Singh (MP and RAJA of Bharatpur) resigned from Loksabha but after some time when they realised its benefits they took 'U' turn..........and tried by all manipulations to get included in the OBC list.

for example:

Jats bargained successfully with Atal Bihari Vajpayee who promised OBC status to Jats. The National Democratic Alliance government, which began its tenure in 1999, gave the Jat community OBC status.While the Backward Classes Commission in Rajasthan was yet to determine the status of Jats in the state, Delhi Government"s Commission for Other Backward Classes had not only recommended OBC status for Jats in Delhi but also held the Jats in Rajasthan to be equally deserving of this status( October, 1999). The Delhi Government"s Commission for Other Backward Classes was headed by former BJP MP, Justice (retired) Guman Mal Lodha. Moreover, the findings of the Gurnam Singh Commission in Haryana suggesting that Jats were socially more backward than many of the Scheduled Castes, including those who were traditionally associated with scavenging are nothing but height of manipulation to find place in OBC list.

These examples are just indicative and not exhaustive...........there are several other reasons why you can not compare Jats with Gujars...........?

But still Gujars can learn something from Jats viz. unity, supporting each other, quick changeing of attitude and side as the situation demands, cleverness in exploring any situation, availing education & employment opportunities by any possible means..................and so on.....!!~!

[singh]

The Jats are opportunist and not loyal to any one including our mother land can be seen not only by their loyalty to britishers during 1857 which opened new era of their over all development but in 1761 they ( read crafty king Surajmal of Bharatpur) betrayed Maratha sardar SADASHIV RAO during the 3rd battle of Panipat and later looted the Maratha Governor of Delhi when he was going to Agra with considerable treasure.

The Jats under Suraj Mal benefited significantly by withdrawing in the battle of Panipat at midway .Their withdrawal from the ensuing battle played a crucial role in its result.

Surajmal received Agra from Ahmadshah as the reward of his withdrawal during the struggle at Panipat.

Many historians, including British historians of the time, have argued that had it not been for the weakening of the Maratha power at Panipat, the British might never have had a strong foothold in India.

[vij]

Jaat are described in NCERT Books for class VIII Social Science as Highway Looters ,Thieves (Chors) and Robbers but due to a large hue and cry of Jaat caste this was later deleted from some books.

These Books were being taught to the students for several years.

NCERT is a premier agency in the field of education and this was done during the time of Arjun Singh as Minister of HRD.Govt of India.

[Ashok Harsana]

Jats are in the position to control govts in haryana, punjab and Rajasthan due their socio-economic stength > Reason > Loyality to britishers---------------GUJJARS DONT NEED THAT

Jats have a larger population for the above mentioned reason-----------------GUJJARS DONT NEED THAT

Jats have a regiment by their caste name in Army, Gujjars dont have it Reason: same--------------------GUJJARS DONT NEED THAT

We Gujjars dont need anything which requires us to be Illoyal, infidel, shameless and opprtunist. This was the decisoin of our ancestors and we respect, Adopt and follow the decision even today. If u think history is "Only discussing past" , You are wrong my friend, We need "history" to know, how a particular person or community behaved in the past, so that we can make our future decisions in a better way.

And you guys know it better that Jats and Gujjars are natural rivlas ( Specially in north western India).
So these kind of topics are not unexpected on discussion forums.

I hope u understand that Gujjars are progressing very very fast. Jats have been developing their socio-economic conditions since last 250 years now.
Gujjars joined this race in 1954. But fortunately, the progress of India during 1990 to 2010 accounts much more than that of during last two centuries, so we are not left far behind, we are catching up very fast and everyone knows that Gujjars are very good at adjusting thelselves in every scenario.

Best Regards

[Peace]

Hey friends I really didn't like this topic ,this will result in nothing.
In todays world Gurjars fights with Gurjars and Jaat is rival of Jaat , So there is no big deal in Gurjar and Jaat riveraly. brothers do fight sometime.

And One thing We Gurjars cannot change history and neither Jaats , but what we can change is our present .
Jaat are comming out to support Gurjars and So do Gurjar are there for jaat . and it can be seen in our daily life.
We must support each other and stand together , it is much logical rather than fighting on what happen in past .
and Gurjar are best when it comes for there country and we can do this for our country .
Peace.