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Post by Ashok Harsana on Dec 24, 2014 11:14:19 GMT 5.5
Right Bhaisahab, But we need to pay attention to the nomenclature of Gurjar Gotras. As you may notice that most of the Gotras have taken their form after the area they ruled or habited, the Khutanas must had been from Khotan and so on. On the other hand many of the other prominent Gotra were just derived from the word Gurjar such as Gusan (Kusan) and Gorsi. Therefore, it is very clear from the above that the word Kusan was derived from Gujar but it certainly did not represent the entire Gujar tribe. It was most probably used by the people ruling a certain area. The above theory becomes stronger when we look at the area where all this upheaval was taking place in 1st Century BC. This was near Present day's south Iran where the Kushan Rulers hailed from. This area is called Khorasan province today. The capital is called Brijand and there is a village called Gusar. This village is also called Kushar or Kusar and if your search for Gusar, it automatically redirects you to the Kushar page. There is another village named Kushan. This makes it simply clear that the branch of Yuezhi or Gujjar which ruled this area were called Gusar or Kusar or Kusan. Please see: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mushan,_Iran en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuhsar,_South_Khorasan en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KasanaqPlease read the following for more interesting information: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gujar_Kurashvilien.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gurjaani_Municipalityen.wikipedia.org/wiki/GuriaHope this helps. Regards |
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aps
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Post by aps on Dec 24, 2014 17:03:08 GMT 5.5
Kushan is not derived from Gurjara but from Kush. The Sanskrit word is Kush-anvaya like for Pratihars are written Rajor inscription as Pratihar-anvaya of Shri Gurjjara. Kush was the elder son of lord Ram and Kushans are descendants of Kusa. Here anvaya means, of lineage or of Kul or of gotra.
For Khatana I have given historical evidences of Rajatiraja Vijay Singh Khatana elsewhere at your site. Vijay Singh Khatana was Companion of Kanishka and ruled from Khotan ( present day Hetian of China) and in Chinese annals is referred as Yuechi prince. So it is based of historical facts other than support of similarity of names. Laxmana was younger brother of lord Rama and is mentioned as Pratiharya in Gwalior inscription of Gurjar Samrat Mihir Bhoja Mahan.
Pratihar in Sanskrit means the great-great warrior who can kill the enemy is his own citadel and not 'chokidar' as written by that moron who was named as RC majumdar. Laxmana killed Meghnada who the most brave warrior in Lankan forces and hence named as Pratiharya. This slave who was named as RC majumdar written bad about Gurjjars and at one other place related Bhatti Gurjjars to Bhandi-kul whereas Bhandi was a historical person who was maternal uncle of Harsha Vardan of Kannauj and Bhatti is also a celebrated gotra of Gurjjars.
Lord Buddha is also mentioned as Pratihar when he controlled a mad elephant in a Buddhist story.
Moreover I would not indulge any further is this thread just to prove the point that the word Kushan is not derived from the word Gurjara. I became a member of this site at time when someone pretended to be a Gujjar and kept asking various questions about Kasanas and indirectly tried to lead his discussion to prove that Kushano were not a branch of Gurjjaras.
Regards.
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Post by Ashok Harsana on Dec 26, 2014 11:43:27 GMT 5.5
Very well, lets not discuss the point of Kushan and move over to other Gotras: Please read at the following link en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/AjmerIt says under the history Tab: According to Rajputana Gazetteer, Ajmer was held by Chechi Gurjars until about 700 years ago. Ajmer (Sanskrit अजय-मेरु Ajayameru meaning "Invincible Spine") was founded in the late 7th century A.D. by Ajayraj Singh Chauhan. Chauhan clan is a branch of Chechi Gurjars |
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aps
Regular Member
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Post by aps on Dec 31, 2014 13:44:15 GMT 5.5
Very well, lets not discuss the point of Kushan and move over to other Gotras: According to Rajputana Gazetteer, Ajmer was held by Chechi Gurjars until about 700 years ago. Ajmer (Sanskrit अजय-मेरु Ajayameru meaning "Invincible Spine") was founded in the late 7th century A.D. by Ajayraj Singh Chauhan. Chauhan clan is a branch of Chechi GurjarsPresent day Tashkent is distorted form Chechi-Khand of sthe Sankrit language. This supports that Chechi, Khalchyan and Chauhan belong to one subclan of Yuechis or Gurjaras.Tashkent is the capital of present day Uzbekistan and Khalchyan is another city in the same country. Ajmer was made the capital of Gurjar Chauhans when Jaisalmer was lost by them in 11th. century. |
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Post by humgujjar on Feb 4, 2015 16:30:11 GMT 5.5
The Yuezhis were definitely Indians who had mixed with Iranians and Scythians/Sakas (Central-Asians). Thats why they are also called Indo-Iranians and Indo-Scythians. The reason Yuezhis are mistaken as "real" Scythians/Sakas is due to the natural fact that Yuezhis had adopted Saka/Scythian tribal identity/culture/ethnicity/life-style. It is important to remember that Scythian/Saka is a general term for many different tribes that inhabited Central-Asia in ancient times, rather than a specific tribe or culture. The Scythians/Sakas definately included an Indian element commonly refered to as Indo-Scythian and it seems at one point they were the rulers of Scythia or Sakastan.
The ancient literature of India, including Ramayana, alludes to conflicts between the Sakas (Central Asians) and Indians. It is therefore possible that a group of Indians that was in conflict with the Sakas, conquered parts of Iran and Central Asia, and made permanent military settlements in their newly acquired domains. As is the custom with all military settlements they (Indians) married the leading clans of their subjects (Central Asians/Sakas) and eventually formed new blood alliances to fortify their hold. The Mughals also went through such a process when they settled in India.
Therefore, these ancient Indians that conquered some parts of Iran and Central-Asia are the ancestors of the Gujjars. Common sense would demand that these ancient Indians were Kshtriyas, and most likely Raghuvanshis, who took with them the idea of Sun Worship to Iran and Central Asia. The oldest known Gujjars were Sun Worshippers too.
The Puranas do speak of a Kshtriya group known as Gurjan, which could be the same name as Gurjaran (Gurjar). The Gurjans were the royal guards of Sri Dasharat Gurtar, and as the Gurjara-Pratiharas claim descent from Sri Lakshmana (son of Sri Dasharat Gurtar), it is very much possible that the Gurjans and Gurjarans (Gurjars / Gujjars) are one and same people.
I will provide my sources as soon as possible, when time will permit, to academically substantiate my point. Cheers and I hope we can keep the ball rolling on this!
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UPDATE**
Here are some detailed references from three very important historians of the British era.
(People of India, Sir Herbert Hope Risley. Second Edition. Page XX, Introduction written by W.Crooke)
“Accepting the fact the people of Central Asia are of an uniform brachycephalic type, Risley argued that it was impossible to suppose that the long-headed Rajputs and Jats could be descended from races entering India from that region. It is now believed by many scholars that the term Scythian or Hun does not represent homogeneous ethnical types; that as the Greeks and Romans confounded Gauls with Germans ---and to most Greeks a Scythian was any barbarian from the east of Europe,---so it is held to be possible that the Hindus termed any savage enemy who crossed the Himalaya a Saka or a Huna, migrants from a region which displays many different physical typed. It is now generally admitted that these Hun princes rapidly became Hinduised and that from one of their clans, the Gurjara, the present Rajputs were largely, if not wholly, derived.”
(The Journal of the Royal Asiatic Society of Great Britain and Ireland. 1909, page 60. “The Gurjaras of Rajputana and Kanauj” by Vincent A. Smith)
“After the defeat of the Persian king Firoz in 484 A.D., the Huns chiefly used degraded copies of the Sassanian coinage, and in India emitted extensive series of coins obviously modelled on the Sassanian type, and consequently classified by numismatists as Indo-Sassanian. Many varieties of this Indo-Sassanian coinage, especially those bearing the names of Toramana and Mihiragula or Mihirakula, can be recognized with certainty as Hun issues.
The long series of Gadhiya or Gadhaiya coins in base silver and copper or bronze, although usually without legends or dates, may be assigned now with equal confidence to the Gurjaras. These coins, which present the Sassanian type in its utmost degradation, are found most abundantly in the countries occupied by the Gurjara clans, which quickly developed into Hindu castes, and they evidently formed the ordinary currency of the Gurjara kingdoms in Western Indian and Rajputana for centuries. A Jain writer relates a legend which expressly connects the origin of the Gadhiya coinage with Bhilmal, the Gurjara capital. One coin, not of the Gadhiya type, bearing the name of Vyaghramukha has been published. That name being of rare occurrence, the piece, which is of rude fabric and comes from a locality where it was associated with White Hun coins, is almost certainly a coin of Vyaghramukha, the Chapa Raja of Bhilmal in 528 A.D. The Chapas were a branch of the Gurjaras. The coin closely resembles in fabric the undoubted Hun issues, and when I published it I believed it to have been struck by a White Hun chief, but now perceive that it is Gurjara. The Gurjara lineage of King Mihir Bhoja being an established fact, his Adi-varaha coins, which imitate the Sassanian coinage in another fashion must also be classed among the the Gurjara issues. We can thus see that the numismatic connection between the Huns and the Gurjaras is extremely close. The fact strongly supports the inference derived from inscriptions and literature that the two tribes were associated. The numismatic evidence also indicated that the Gurjaras were immigrants of later date than the Huns.”
(Four Reports Made During the Years, 1862-63-64-65, Volume 2 . Sir Alexander Cunningham, PAGE 70.)
“The Ephthalites or White Huns must be the same people as the Little Yuchi. I was led to this conclusion by the name of Cidaritoe, which is applied to the White Huns by Priscus, and which is found under the form of Kedara, not only on the Indian gold coins of the Hidda Tope, but also on the Kashmirian coins of Toramana and Pravarasena. Now Meghavuhan, the grand father of Toramana and the founder of his dynasty, is said to have been previously under the protection of Gopaditya, King of Gandhara, and as he reigned only seven generations before A.D. 625, the date of both kings may be fixed with some certainty about A.D. 450. Here, then, we have the name of Kedara appearing on the coins of Kabul and Kashmir at the very same time that Kitolo, the leader of the Katorman tribe, is said to have occupied Kabul and Gandhara. I therefore concluded that the Kedara of the coins, the Katorman of Abu Rihan, the Kitolo of the Chinese, and the Cidaritoe or White Huns of Priscus are the same people. I am now satisfied that Priscus is wrong in applying the name of Cidaritoe to the White Huns. The mistake was a natural one, for the White Huns and the Little Yuchi rose to notice at the same time, at the beginning of the 5th century, and as they were near neighbors, a distant Latin author may be excused for confounding two barbarous races.
Most of our knowledge of the White Huns is derived from the Chinese, who have preserved a list of the kings with short accounts of their reigns. But the brief notices of the Persian and classical writers also are very valuable, as they refer to the most brilliant period of their career, when they waged war on equal terms with some of the most powerful of the Sassanian Kings. According to the Chinese, the founder of the Sogdian dynasty of White Huns was Shelun, who, in A.D. 385, retired to the west with his brother, and in 402, after the defeat of the Hiungnu, changed the old title of Tsanyu to Khakan, and assumed the new name of kieu-teu-fa or the “good charioteer and archer”. He died in 410, and after three short and uneventful reigns, was succeeded in 428 by his cousin's son Uti, who assumed the title of Solien Khan or the “Divine King”. During a reign of fifteen years Solien conquered the Wei Tartars, and received a Chinese princess in marriage. To him also we must attribute the Scvthian invasion of Persia, which took place during the reign of Bahram-Gor. His successor Chu Khan, after a fruitless war with the Chinese, died in A.D. 464, and left the throne to his son Yuchin, who took the title of Shulo-Puchin Khan, or the “Bountiful Prince”. This is without doubt the same prince whom the Persian historians call Khush Nawaz, or the “Bountiful”, which is a literal translation of the title which he assumed on his accession. To his aid the Persians ascribe the elevation of Firoz to the Sassanian throne; but as this event took place in A.D. 458, the assistance must have been given by his father. Firoz, however, made war on Khush Nawsz about A.D. 480, and only escaped destruction through the clemency of the prince whom he had wantingly attacked. Smarting under the disgrace, the Sassanian King, in 484, again invaded the territories of Khush Nawaz, and lost both his army and life. Eusebius, an ambassador from the Emperor Zeno, accompanied Firoz on this rash expedition, and from him the Western World learned that the conquests of the Epthalite Kings “had been stretched from the Caspian to heart of India, that their throne was enriched with emeralds, and their cavalry supported by a line of two thousand elephants”.”
My comments:
Reading the above references it becomes clear that Risley believed that the Jatts, Gujjars, and Rajputs are "racially" different from the Central-Asians but "culturally" similar. The reference from V.A.Smith makes it clear that the Huna and Gurjaras were same people, as their coins were same type, he talks about Vyaghramukha Chapa (Gujjar clan) as someone who issued coins identical to the Huna coins. Alexander Cunnigham, who belived that the Yuchis were Gurjaras, also beleived that the White Huns and Little Yuchi were same people, hence White Huns and Gujjars are same people. All of this, points to the fact that Indians, such as Gujjars and Jatts, were residents of Central Asia for a long period of time, moved there in quite ancient times, and came back to India at the dawn of Christian era, i.e. A.D. 100. This "coming back" of these ancient Indians (Gujjars and Jatts) is wrongfully termed as "Scythian invasion of India" because these Indians had adopted the Scythian "culture", and hence, appeared same as the Scythians (Sakas / Shakas).
I welcome all feedback!
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Post by Ashok Harsana on Feb 5, 2015 10:42:08 GMT 5.5
Great Information, I concur with it.
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aps
Regular Member
Posts: 76
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Post by aps on Feb 7, 2015 14:51:32 GMT 5.5
It is regarding the history of Decimal Number System which has been later used by Arabs and European Countries. It is in Sanskrit which itself explain the origin of Gujjar Tribe which is undivided India. The Yoga-system of Patañjali: Or, The Ancient Hindu Doctrine of ... - Google Books Resultby Patañjali, Vācaspatimiśra, Vyāsa, James ... - 1973 - Health & Fitness - 381 pages The oldest epigraphic ' instance of the use of the decimal system is in the Gurjara inscription of AD 595. With one obscure and doubtful exception, ... books.google.co.in/books?isbn=0879680830 Read more: ashokharsana.proboards.com/thread/123#ixzz3R2u2ontgPlease see my above post in the thread of Gujjar inscriptions. 595AD was the peak of Hepthalite branch of Gurjjars . Zero was invented under their rule during this period, which was later used by Arabs and spread over all over world.595AD the Persians and turks, who were earlier vassals of Gurjjars, united together and asserted independence. The Turkic Khan gave his daughter to Persian ruler and Persian ruler gave his daughter to Turkic khan in marriages and both of them united and defeated the Gurjjars.. Balkha, which was the capital of Hepthelites was lost at this time only to be retaken again. That was the time Bhaskarvarman of Gaudas, the remnants of Guptas who were mnisters to Gujjars in Malwa region, and Prabhakarvardan of Shri-Kantha also started asserting independence in present day India. against the Muakhris who were a part of Hepthalites. It was really difficult time for Gurjjar Empire which was including 40 countries that time spread from present day India to Central Asia. However I would like to correct you on the following. 1. Shakas were enemies of Gurjjars. Gurjjars were protector of Cows and avoided six gotras while arranging in marriages of their children. The Shakas were cow eaters and cross cousin marriages were common among them. 2. Huns were enemies of Gurrajars. Hun Gotra among Gurrjars is a misnomer. They are called Hun since they were rulers of Hun-desa under Gujjars Hepthalites. Part of present day Tibet was called Hun-Desa at that point of time. Mansarovar lake was situated in Bhota-Desa which was also part of present day Tibet region. The Sub-clan of Gurjjar Bhattis is derived from this Bhota region as they were rulers of Bhota region before 595AD. At 650 AD Tibet was also lost by the Gurjjars. Kashmir was usurped by Lalitaditya at about 715 AD. Palas arose in Guada region. Rashtrakuta who were earlier employees of Gurjjar Solankis also joined the services under Arabs. All these powers united with Arabs against the Gurjjars whom Nagabhatta-I Of Gwalior inscriptions defeated in the first quarter of eighth century in Balkha in central Asia. |
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Post by humgujjar on Feb 8, 2015 1:41:41 GMT 5.5
Great Information, I concur with it. Thanks Ashok Bhai, much appreciated! I think the migrations and the settlements of the Gujjar tribe are a fascinating topic which need to be understood properly, in their right context, before one can really appreciate the history of our tribe. I find it amazing to see the ancient Gujjars were spread so far and wide geographically, the immigration and settlements of Yuezhis/Yuchis are definitely key to this study. 1. Shakas were enemies of Gurjjars. Gurjjars were protector of Cows and avoided six gotras while arranging in marriages of their children. The Shakas were cow eaters and cross cousin marriages were common among them. 2. Huns were enemies of Gurrajars. Hun Gotra among Gurrjars is a misnomer. They are called Hun since they were rulers of Hun-desa under Gujjars Hepthalites. Part of present day Tibet was called Hun-Desa at that point of time. Mansarovar lake was situated in Bhota-Desa which was also part of present day Tibet region. The Sub-clan of Gurjjar Bhattis is derived from this Bhota region as they were rulers of Bhota region before 595AD. At 650 AD Tibet was also lost by the Gurjjars. Kashmir was usurped by Lalitaditya at about 715 AD. Palas arose in Guada region. Rashtrakuta who were earlier employees of Gurjjar Solankis also joined the services under Arabs. All these powers united with Arabs against the Gurjjars whom Nagabhatta-I Of Gwalior inscriptions defeated in the first quarter of eighth century in Balkha in central Asia. Ji Bhai saab, the Shakas were indeed enemies of Gujjars and Indians. The conflict between these groups go as far back as the times of Ramayana, and Puranas, i.e. much before Ashoka. It seems improbable that the Gujjars and Indians never mixed with the Shakas, given the traditions of invaders back in the days, dont you think? The hundred and thousands of Gujjar soldiers, that went as far as Caspian Sea and Tarim Basin, would have had to marry with the local women, instead of importing their wives from India. Brahma Gupta, the court mathmatician of the Gurjjar King Vyaghramukha Chapa, was in fact the one who is credited with inventing zero. The oldest instance of the decimal system is also found in the inscription of a Gurjjar king. The history of our tribe is so rich, and its sad that it is not recognized by the general people, just like the history of the Rajputs. Thanks for the reply, and if you can, please elaborate further on the Tibetan and Gurjara connection. Thanks! |
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Post by Ashok Harsana on Feb 9, 2015 10:27:26 GMT 5.5
Hun Gotra among Gurjars: This is a topic which has made me curious during my research on Gurjars. I ended up deciding the following two possibilities:
1. Huns who were defeated by Yasodharman were assimilated into Gurjars (which was a common practice those days).
2. Huns or Hepthalites were a clan of Yuezhis which entered India as later Yuezhis. This theroy is further supported by the fact that most of the royal clans (among Gurjars and Rajputs) such as Tomars, Chauhans etc. were in turn traced their origin to Hepthalites.
I believe the research work by AP Singh Bhaisahab and Hum Gujjar ji might shed some light over this.
Regards
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aps
Regular Member
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Post by aps on Feb 10, 2015 13:11:02 GMT 5.5
1. Use of Zero www.ams.org/samplings/feature-column/fcarc-india-zeroThis inscription gives us the follwing additional informations other than that zero was first time used in this inscription.. 1. That Bhilla-Bhat was a Kotpal of Gwalior and General to protect the existing boundire 0f Gurjara Empire. 2. He was of Varrajara Gotra ( Present day Bajjad subclan of Gurjaras. Nishane Haider Pakistan Major Tufail Ahmed was born in present day India in this celebrated gotra of Gurjjars. 3. Nagara clan is further to a sub can of Varrajrars. 4. Gwalior fort was the residence of Gurjara Samrat Mihir Bhoja the Great. 5. Char-Bhuja temples were built by Bhailla-Bhatta are the temple of lord Rama. Later Bhilla- Swamin temples were built at present day Bhilas named so after Bhailla Bhatta which proves that he was great Military General of Gurjara army. Bhilla means Surya (Sun) in Sanskrit language. |
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